when filming part of "Flags of our Fathers", was Galt House, and the other heavyweight cars and the streamliner cars Amtrak Certified?
#1 Raffi on 2014-12-26 18:45
Hello Raffi The answer to your question is a BIG NO! If they would have been certified you would have seen many many fan trips use with them. Each car must be altered to the their regs. We are a museum and not a tourist line. Please remember that! Thanks Roger
#1.1 Roger Kramer on 2014-12-28 13:37
it made me think about a basic rule statement for all rolling stock in general. if any car in general were to go out on any stretch of public track(s), they must use roller bearings. don't exactly remember where i read it off of, but i know it exists. or is there more to it? now don't get me wrong, i am perfectly straight with your point. a heavyweight mainline with heavy cars such as galt house would be nice though.
#1.1.1 Raffi on 2015-01-05 20:29
Cars that do not have roller bearings are not allowed in revenue, inter-line freight service. If a railroad is willing to handle equipment with friction bearings, there is no legal prohibition on it. However, the railroad does not HAVE to accept a car that does not have roller bearings. This is all laid out by the AAR Interchange rules.
# Brian L. on 2015-01-07 23:45
Hello Brian L Thanks for your information. Roger
# Roger Kramer on 2015-01-08 12:54
Hello, Raffi and all 1. While I am NOT a "managing authority" at IRM, the following should be at least reasonably accurate. 2. The older friction bearing cars are perfectly safe and legal to operate, when they are correctly maintained. Otherwise, WE couldn't run them. FRA regulations prohibit the use of friction bearing equipment in ROUTINE INTERCHANGE. ANY railroad can operate friction bearing equipment if they want, on their own rails. They just can't ROUTINELY send it over other railroads. While IRM has in the past received and/or legally moved friction bearing equipment off-property on its own wheels, it is usually far easier and more "reliable" to move this equipment on railcar or via truck since ANY railroad can refuse the "advance" permission required for a move over their tracks. Steam locomotives are governed such that if it is legal to operate anywhere, it's legal to operate everywhere, regardless of bearing type installed. 3. Amtrak Certification, even when potentially "correct" for a museum, is a far more intrusive process than most people realize when talking about older "heavyweight" equipment. Each car must be converted to Amtrak type Head End Power, must have retention toilets, may require replacement of all windows with Lexan, and in many cases also requires MU (locomotive control) pass-through as well. Finally, the car has to be inspected and passed by Amtrak's mechanical department. In short, unless the piece of equipment was already up to current Amtrak Standard before we received it, certification would be an expensive unpleasant mess. 4. The few pieces of equipment that would be prime candidates for Amtrak Certification (based on marketability of salable tickets) aren't nearly close enough to being operable for Amtrak certification to be an issue. The Galt House is NOT on that list because the "number one" candidate (Dover Straight) has enough of a kitchen to feed all of its revenue capacity plus one other car, and the "number two" candidate (Lake City) wouldn't have enough passengers to justify a full diner car, thus forcing it to "partner" with Dover Straight. The "number three" candidate (Silver Pony) has enough issues to work through in its restoration process that by the time we got to the point of "trying" for Amtrak Certification, we would also have acquired one of the ex-CB&Q Heritage Diners from Amtrak in roadworthy condition if we sent it with food service at all. 5. We would face similar issues if we dispatched a complete train instead of just a car or two on Amtrak scheduled service. While we wouldn't need "Amtrak Certification" per se; the trainset would need to be fully self-sufficient, with retention toilets and so on, like the Nebraska Zephyr. 6. While we are a non-profit, that doesn't mean that we can lose money and still remain open. If we were to "certify" additional equipment (remember that we have the Nebraska Zephyr, that is road ready RIGHT NOW,) we would have to "make back" the "investment" in certification with charter and "special" ticket and refreshment sales on those cars within one year. In short, Amtrak Certification is possible, but highly unlikely. 7. We are always looking for new and more desirable ways to present our collections to the general public. Having some pieces of our collection available for charter by responsible parties or for "special" excursions has been discussed for years. In fact, the Zephyr has made runs in the last couple of years, and will certainly run again at some point in the future. If we find a way to actually make more equipment "available" and make sufficient profit to offset costs and risks to the equipment while we're at it, you can rest assured that we will. Thanks. Brian J. Patterson.
#2 Brian J. Patterson on 2015-01-08 13:05
Almost all of what Brian P says is correct. The only points I would clarify is that the FRA does NOT regulate friction bearings. Railfan rumor that is untrue. Friction bearings in interchange is solely the AAR's business. The FRA does however prohibit freight cars over 50 years old in interline, revenue service. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG WITH FRICTION BEARINGS PROVIDED THEY ARE MAINTAINED PROPERLY! Some of the cars that went to Flags of Our Fathers had friction bearings under them and it worked just fine. (Inglehome has some friction bearings and DMIR 84 is all friction bearings). Also, the easiest two cars on the property to get Amtrak certification for would be former UPRR "Pacific Peak" 10-6 Sleeper and former NP "Loch Sloy" 24-8 Slumbercoach. Both of these cars were HEP comversions by Amtrak, and in the case of the Peak, most if not all of the components are still there. The Sloy has some missing components, but it still has a jump on Dover Strait and Lake City in that the HEP trainlines, heating systems, and MU and Comm. jumpers are already in place and we don't have to gut the cars to install those systems. It's also cheaper to do a 40 year inspection (mandatory) on a 2 axle truck than a 6 axle truck.
#2.1 Brian L. on 2015-01-09 02:35
Does Pony also have HEP and MU cabling installed? A dome coach would certainly do better in excursion service than a sleeper.
#2.1.1 David Streeter on 2015-01-29 11:55
Hello Dave The Silver Pony does not have Hep or Mu cables on or underneath it. BTY, this Spring we are looking for a group of volunteers to begin installation of windows. Training will be provided for the volunteers. If interested see Paul Cronin or myself for further details. Thanks Roger Kramer
# Roger Kramer on 2015-01-29 17:00
No, it needs a Stadco generator.
# Jeron G. on 2015-01-29 21:06
Pony has no HEP or M.U. cables at the moment. She is almost pure CZ as she sits now. If her #3 axle had a Spicer Drive on it, you could hook up the generator under the car.
# Brian L. on 2015-01-29 23:30
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